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Bill Gregory
02-11-2008, 10:19 AM
The BBC has this story. I've just posted the first few lines and the URL follows:

Twenty of Manila's poorest residents have filed a legal challenge against what they say is a ban on contraception.

The group - 16 women and four of their husbands - are fighting a policy which they say denies them access to condoms, to the pill and other effective forms of family planning.
This has had a devastating effect on their lives, they argue, causing unwanted pregnancies, pushing them further into poverty and harming their health and wellbeing.
The case has sparked debate in the Philippines where, says Professor Michael Tan, chair of the anthropology department at the University of the Philippines, there is no national policy on family planning. More than 80% of Filipinos are Roman Catholics and the Church is hugely influential. Abortion is banned and President Gloria Arroyo openly backs the Church's anti-contraception stance.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7234291.stm

Jeff
02-11-2008, 11:16 AM
Roman catholic belief forbid the use of contraceptions. But many catholics indulge. Why? Meaning not all catholics are follower of Roman catholic doctrine. A rebel by its own. So sad even in religion we humans are not one.

justme
02-11-2008, 02:00 PM
The BBC has this story. I've just posted the first few lines and the URL follows:

Twenty of Manila's poorest residents have filed a legal challenge against what they say is a ban on contraception.

The group - 16 women and four of their husbands - are fighting a policy which they say denies them access to condoms, to the pill and other effective forms of family planning.
This has had a devastating effect on their lives, they argue, causing unwanted pregnancies, pushing them further into poverty and harming their health and wellbeing.
The case has sparked debate in the Philippines where, says Professor Michael Tan, chair of the anthropology department at the University of the Philippines, there is no national policy on family planning. More than 80% of Filipinos are Roman Catholics and the Church is hugely influential. Abortion is banned and President Gloria Arroyo openly backs the Church's anti-contraception stance.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7234291.stm

jeez, pano na ngaun kung bawal na ang contraceptives? and there are so many cases of abortions and unwanted pregnancies...especially nowadays where teenagers are more active in premarital sex... and no matter how much values education is being implemented at home and in schools...still many girls got pregnant each year... and how about those poor families who have do-re-mi-fa-so-la-ti-do number of children? wala ba taung right na mag use ng contraceptives?
and if the Church will suggest...abstinence.... will that work?
and using rhythm and withdrawal methods----are not 100 percent safe...

so what other option do we have?

Jeff
02-11-2008, 04:20 PM
The solution there is social consciousness, ang pagka mulat sa katotohanan. Disciplina sa sarili at marunong mag control sa kapusokan. Use withdrawal or rythm it is a natural way of preventing. Abstain is the ultimate.

justme
02-11-2008, 05:43 PM
The solution there is social consciousness, ang pagka mulat sa katotohanan. Disciplina sa sarili at marunong mag control sa kapusokan. Use withdrawal or rythm it is a natural way of preventing. Abstain is the ultimate.

ikaw ba to pare?hehehe...joke....nowadays, in our generation--- seldom na ang abstinence especially sa mga mapupusok na kabataan...hehehe.... mao gani daghan buntis diri sa school...hay pastilan!

Bill Gregory
02-11-2008, 08:19 PM
.....is purely economic. If people who cannot afford to have children persist in having five, six or seven, then there is no hope for the Philippine economy. The gap between the haves and the have-nots will increase with growing persistence. By the 'haves' I'm only talking about the middle class and I'm leaving the corrupt and corruption out of it. One can argue that the Government doesn't care about poverty and a good case can be made for this, but even if they did care there is only so much they can do in terms of creating jobs and subsidising education.

If we have more children than we can sensibly educate to a 'reasonable' level then the seeds of society breakdown are being sown - not just crime which is bad enough already and will increase enormously but there will also be overall degradation in the entry level of recruits to the army, the police, government services, shop assistants etc etc. People who cannot find jobs easily will work for a pittance just to have a job - greedy and stupid employers plus those with budget constraints will take the least-cost workers in preference to those whose families have done their best to provide a sensible education.

We cannot blame the government unless we willingly pay enormous taxes. The only solution is less children which I think means ready availability and understanding of contraception which will need to be subsidised. Forget what you may think the Bible says, ignore what the church says (they have no remit to manage the finances or economy of the country), common-sense tells us that the Philippines cannot revitalise without a drastic reduction in the birth-rate. I cannot think of any solution other than a hugh drive to encourage reliable birth control, before we have to make it compulsory as other countries have done or tried.

Jeff
02-12-2008, 06:51 AM
It's the law of supply and demand. Less food high consumption meaning poverty, famine, high crime rate, and social disorder. Bottom line is control.

agta
02-12-2008, 07:05 AM
Poorest among the poor? The one who said that could be dreaming! The truth is: Even the ordinary poor could not afford to file a complaint in court. And now they would say that the poorest among the poor filed a case in court?

They are simply using the poor for their own agenda! They do not even know what is poor or how is it to live being poor.

Jeff
04-28-2008, 06:45 AM
Poorest among the poor? The one who said that could be dreaming! The truth is: Even the ordinary poor could not afford to file a complaint in court. And now they would say that the poorest among the poor filed a case in court?

They are simply using the poor for their own agenda! They do not even know what is poor or how is it to live being poor.

It's not a sin to be a poor, fact is GOD made the world balance. There are rich there are poor, there are those who have plenty there are also those that have none. That is why our world in hang in a balance, but there are possible cases wherein that balance will be at stake. For example, population explosion. If we humans will not help each other solving over population, there comes a time there will be less death rate, but overwhelming birth rate meaning demand will be extremely high, less supply, more crime rate, more chaos, men tends to self destruct... bottom line kawawa ang mga batang paslit.

Europa
04-28-2008, 11:53 AM
The BBC has this story. I've just posted the first few lines and the URL follows:

Twenty of Manila's poorest residents have filed a legal challenge against what they say is a ban on contraception.

The group - 16 women and four of their husbands - are fighting a policy which they say denies them access to condoms, to the pill and other effective forms of family planning.
This has had a devastating effect on their lives, they argue, causing unwanted pregnancies, pushing them further into poverty and harming their health and wellbeing.
The case has sparked debate in the Philippines where, says Professor Michael Tan, chair of the anthropology department at the University of the Philippines, there is no national policy on family planning. More than 80% of Filipinos are Roman Catholics and the Church is hugely influential. Abortion is banned and President Gloria Arroyo openly backs the Church's anti-contraception stance.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7234291.stm

SAD TO READ THIS KIND OF THINGS, INSPITE THE MOST MODERN TECHNOLOGIES NOW A DAYS, HERE WE ARE IN THE PHILIPPINES STILL FIGHTING FOR CONDOMS AND SO AND SO, USING GOD"S NAME IN EVERY WORDS AND CATHOLISM, CHURCH AND WHATEVER INVOLVING GODS NAME..MAG FAMILY PLANNING LANG BAWAL SA CHURCH BAWAL SA ROMAN CATHOLIC, AND DAMING EXCUSES, SAMANTALANG PWEDE NAMAN GAWIN YAN INDIVIDUALLY. MAPIGILAN BA NG GOBYERNO KONG SA ISANG SLUM AREA MAY RONG NAG PAHILOT IPALAGLAG ANG IBINUNTIS DAHIL WALANG AMA, OR WALANG IPAKAIN..MAPIGILAN BA NG RELIGION OR GOBERNO NA ANG ISANG SOCIALITE UBOD NG YAMAN NAG PALAGLAG NG LIHIM DAHIL NAKAKAHIYA SA SOCIETY NA GINAGALAWAN NILA? HMMMP EWAN. MANIWALA PA AKO SA SALITANG "NASA DIYOS ANG AWA PERO NASA TAO ANG GAWA"HAYYY ANG DAMING PLASTIK NA NAGKAKALAT SA MUNDO"

newmoonmaiden
04-30-2008, 04:02 PM
.....is purely economic. If people who cannot afford to have children persist in having five, six or seven, then there is no hope for the Philippine economy. The gap between the haves and the have-nots will increase with growing persistence. By the 'haves' I'm only talking about the middle class and I'm leaving the corrupt and corruption out of it. One can argue that the Government doesn't care about poverty and a good case can be made for this, but even if they did care there is only so much they can do in terms of creating jobs and subsidising education.

If we have more children than we can sensibly educate to a 'reasonable' level then the seeds of society breakdown are being sown - not just crime which is bad enough already and will increase enormously but there will also be overall degradation in the entry level of recruits to the army, the police, government services, shop assistants etc etc. People who cannot find jobs easily will work for a pittance just to have a job - greedy and stupid employers plus those with budget constraints will take the least-cost workers in preference to those whose families have done their best to provide a sensible education.

We cannot blame the government unless we willingly pay enormous taxes. The only solution is less children which I think means ready availability and understanding of contraception which will need to be subsidised. Forget what you may think the Bible says, ignore what the church says (they have no remit to manage the finances or economy of the country), common-sense tells us that the Philippines cannot revitalise without a drastic reduction in the birth-rate. I cannot think of any solution other than a hugh drive to encourage reliable birth control, before we have to make it compulsory as other countries have done or tried.

I agree on the most, except that it isn't as if families "persist" to have more children than they can account for. Sex education is terribly substandard in the Philippines, specially in the provinces. The most talk about sex and anything related to it is that it is "taboo". Poor people, more than anyone else, know the cost of another mouth to feed. We cannot stop people from doing what God made them to (specially when the nights are clod and when there's nothing else to do), but being simple and God fearing, they listen to what the priests say and don't bother with condoms (if they knew how condoms worked at all). When the wife conceives, her guilt (of how the unborn child is going to measure in the family budget) either pushes her to go to a manghihilot or try to kill the child on her own. On the first option, the manghihilot might not be able to do such a good job, and instead, put both mother and child in jeopardy, resulting in maternal death.

I'm getting ahead of myself.

Aside from this, we cannot blame all the problems of the Philippines on population increases, though that figures largely. Mis-allocation of resources and mis-prioritization are the parents of a lot of our problems, and not only the government can be blamed of this.

The lack of sex education is just the tip of the iceberg to the digressing quality of education as a whole. Health services are far from ideal... and the list goes on in terms of social services.

No wonder few people care about taxes. The few who can afford to pay taxes go abroad instead, where they get their taxes back in terms of social services.

This is an interesting discussion.
And these are just my two cents on the topic.

agta
05-13-2008, 12:29 AM
SAD TO READ THIS KIND OF THINGS, INSPITE THE MOST MODERN TECHNOLOGIES NOW A DAYS, HERE WE ARE IN THE PHILIPPINES STILL FIGHTING FOR CONDOMS AND SO AND SO, USING GOD"S NAME IN EVERY WORDS AND CATHOLISM, CHURCH AND WHATEVER INVOLVING GODS NAME..MAG FAMILY PLANNING LANG BAWAL SA CHURCH BAWAL SA ROMAN CATHOLIC, AND DAMING EXCUSES, SAMANTALANG PWEDE NAMAN GAWIN YAN INDIVIDUALLY. MAPIGILAN BA NG GOBYERNO KONG SA ISANG SLUM AREA MAY RONG NAG PAHILOT IPALAGLAG ANG IBINUNTIS DAHIL WALANG AMA, OR WALANG IPAKAIN..MAPIGILAN BA NG RELIGION OR GOBERNO NA ANG ISANG SOCIALITE UBOD NG YAMAN NAG PALAGLAG NG LIHIM DAHIL NAKAKAHIYA SA SOCIETY NA GINAGALAWAN NILA? HMMMP EWAN. MANIWALA PA AKO SA SALITANG "NASA DIYOS ANG AWA PERO NASA TAO ANG GAWA"HAYYY ANG DAMING PLASTIK NA NAGKAKALAT SA MUNDO"

That's right, maraming plastic nagkalat sa mundo. Dapat siguro ipagbawal na ng gobyerno ang pagmanufacture at paggamit ng plastic.:D
Seriously, no, hindi pinagbabawal ng Church ang FAMILY PLANNING. Ang pinagbabawal ng Church ay ang paggamit ng mga contraceptives at ang abortion. The Church's stand is clear on this point. Pero kahit pa ipinagbabawal ng Church ang paggamit ng mga contraceptives at abortion, akala ba nila mas marami ang sumusunod dito kesa mga di sumusunod? Ang katotohanan nalalaman natin sa ating kapaligiran. Mas marami ang di sumusunod sa tinuturo ng Church.
Therefore, ang pagdami ng populasyon sa Philippines ay hindi dahil pinagbabawal ng Church ang contraceptives at abortion. Talagang hot lang ang mga Filipino. So, ang tanong: Bakit ba hot ang mga Filipino? Isang pweding sagot dito ay ang pornograpiya. At isa pang pwedeng sagot ay ang sinasabi nilang SEX EDUCATION. Ituturo ba naman nila ang sex sa mga bata! Maraming mga bata tuloy ang mas naging curious ngayon masubukan ang sex.
Kaya, mga bata pa, nawala na ang virginity; mga bata pa nagbuntisan na. Oh pornograpiya at SEX EDUCATION, ang sakit naman ng ginawa niyo!

Jeff
05-13-2008, 06:31 AM
Filipinos are oragon (Bicolanos term). Maybe because of our race and moreover because of mixed blood namely european (espanol), China, Arabs, Philippines is the melting pot all most all race. Note we are more than 80,000,000 population already in a small geographic area compared to Australia (mas marami pa ang baka). Many ways to control, one thing is withdrawal medyo masakit sa ulo lang hehehe. One thing is knowing the mens cycle as my teacher told us hehehe, medyo close monitoring the calendar, stringent process but no violations will be made.

viper
05-13-2008, 08:14 AM
Roman catholic belief forbid the use of contraceptions. But many catholics indulge. Why? Meaning not all catholics are follower of Roman catholic doctrine. A rebel by its own. So sad even in religion we humans are not one.
Because if we follow the rhetoric of the Roman Catholic Church, the population of the Philippines would not only be 80M! It's gratifying to note that more pinoy families think of the economic repercussions in having a big family borne out of the flawed and outdated roman catholic belief.

agta
05-13-2008, 06:56 PM
Because if we follow the rhetoric of the Roman Catholic Church, the population of the Philippines would not only be 80M! It's gratifying to note that more pinoy families think of the economic repercussions in having a big family borne out of the flawed and outdated roman catholic belief.
I wonder what rhetoric of the RCC you are referring about. The Church encourages Family Planning! If this is the rhetoric you are referring about, then I do not see how following it would have made the population of the Philippines not only 80M (we are now 86M)
If Catholics and non-catholics alike would honestly observe Family Family Planning as taught by the Church then surely the population would not have yet reached 86M. But they don't. They instead choose contraception and abortion. The result? The country is punished and so the government got the opposite of what it wants.